Most conservatives aren’t really economically conservative. They too want police, schools, fire dept, infrastructure etc. to be well funded. There’s just also a nebulous idea that “government wastes money” and they don’t want their taxes taken.
Honestly it’s a pretty clever scam by conservatives. Run on a platform of big government is inept, wasting your money, we need to reduce spending and reduce taxes!
Once in office, do nothing. Sabotage functional government. Obstruct long term projects. Now you have things to point to as proof that big government is bad and does nothing, because you were the big government and made sure nothing happens.
Yup, standard fascist procedure. All the Nazi parties in Europe want to be elected to the European Parliament with the very publicly expressed goal of breaking it from the inside to prove that European unity and globalism don’t work.
One of the rallying cries of the Republican party that persuaded so many over the decades has always been fiscal responsibility and tax cuts. They have spent decades persuading voters that paying taxes is a terrible thing. They have claimed that bureaucracy is slow and wasteful. That the taxes people paid have been misappropriated. They have corrupted one of the most important things that a citizen can do for its nation. Pay taxes.
Paying taxes should be seen as a prideful act. This small action provides us with innumerable benefits that every single one of us benefits from.
The voting public has been lied to in an attempt to convince them they don’t receive anything from the taxes they pay. This, as most people should recognize, is a falsehood. From the roads we drive on, the water we drink, and the sewage that gets washed away to the security net that allows millions of Americans to retire every year. Taxes are the foundation that has allowed us to become the strong and comfortable nation that we are.
Taxes are the reason we have such a strong military that many Republicans idolize (while many others denounce.) Taxes are the reason we almost every child in this country has at least a cursory education. Taxes are the reason so many can pursue the careers that keep us safe and healthy, like every single doctor, nurse, and everyone else that helps and support them. Taxes are the reason your community has playgrounds for your children. Taxes are the reason so many farmers even have an income at all.
Crazy, but true. No he didnt want anything well funded.
That’s what he says… But does he drive on public roads? Does he use bridges? Does his residence have access to clean water and a functioning sewer? Etc. etc.
THe biggest difference is “qualified immunity” somehow turning into blanket immunity, followed closely by no duty to “protect and serve”. Paw Patrol takes its duty seriously, and rewards the strength of character to do the right thing and to take responsibility for their actions.
police is the definition of mob justice. the police is the armed wing of the state, and solely exists to keep exploitation viable.
ironically, there would be no need for “deescalation” if the state didn’t exist because each community could just live peacefully based on mutual aid. once mutual aid gets too popular in a capitalist society, that’s when the cops show up to prevent the usurpation of state dominion over all living beings.
And as soon as we can trust everybody to respect each other, that would be a fantastic system. But, unfortunately, there are pieces of shit who will take any opportunity they can to hurt others. Removing all law enforcement will give those people a free pass, and encourage others to do the same
Makes me think of Team America. Cops are dicks, but criminals are assholes. If you don’t get the reference, look it up. It’s a fun analogy.
even if you believe that humans are inherently violent and untrustworthy (white supremacist propaganda), that would be an argument against more hierarchy and deputizing state violence not for police existing.
frankly it sounds like you don’t have lived experience with what it is that police actually do.
Your comments are especially humorous because you are WAY off.
I’ve been through the system. Long story short, I asked how to answer a question on a government form, I did what I was told, and I faced fraud charges. The cops fucked me, my defender fucked me, and the judge fucked me. I have NO faith in the system as it is.
You want to talk about being naive. Are you REALLY trying to tell me that if there was no law enforcement, that everybody would just start being nice to each other? How? Like for real, explain to me the rationale behind that.
I’m totally on your side. Fuck the police. A key lesson I taught my kids is NEVER talk to cops. Period.
Lawless anarchy won’t work either. Those power hungry people who WOULD have become cops just to bully people, are just going to do it without a badge, and we’d find ourselves in a modern wild west. Whoever has the gun, will make the rules. Even the facade of regulation we have now would be gone.
Id actually argue the majority of people are inherently good but something needs to constrain the minority of the inherently “bad”.
I’m arguing for massive reform so don’t @me about what is when we’re arguing about what should be. I’ve had enough lived experience as a melanated individual. I’ve also seen what mob justice does-while a last resort when justice is otherwise obstructed it should not be the first line when it gets things wrong so often (see lynchings).
Policing’s past as slave catchers and continued existence whereby they protect property over people is not what law enforcement should be. However, no matter what society you make there are individuals who will break laws in both minor and major ways. A lot of criminality is a result of socioeconomics but not all and there needs to be a way to enforce punishment on those exceptions in an equitable way.
sorrry, I deleted that lived experience comment because I meant to @ Ryhnoplaz not you.
so we both agree that lynchings are bad. i fail to see how police still existing helps in any way?
the same mechanisms that deputize white people to kill Black people are what leads to justifications of the police existing. the way to solve that is through abolishing hierarchies not by creating more. Black people should have an unconditional right to self-defense against racists and the police still existing is a way to prevent that. their argument is that taking justice in your own hands is harmful because white people/cops always know better than the victim.
also why do we need law enforcement in the first place? the law is inherently arbitrary and is used to criminalize people stealing food to survive and many such things. i think there needs to be a distinction between crime and harm. some crimes are harmless like distributing food and water while some harmful actions like wage theft are not de facto crimes.
lastly, I’d be curious to find out which criminalities you believe aren’t caused by socioeconomic factors? i don’t see how you could argue for that besides appealing to the human nature fallacy.
Most conservatives aren’t really economically conservative. They too want police, schools, fire dept, infrastructure etc. to be well funded. There’s just also a nebulous idea that “government wastes money” and they don’t want their taxes taken.
Honestly it’s a pretty clever scam by conservatives. Run on a platform of big government is inept, wasting your money, we need to reduce spending and reduce taxes! Once in office, do nothing. Sabotage functional government. Obstruct long term projects. Now you have things to point to as proof that big government is bad and does nothing, because you were the big government and made sure nothing happens.
Yup, standard fascist procedure. All the Nazi parties in Europe want to be elected to the European Parliament with the very publicly expressed goal of breaking it from the inside to prove that European unity and globalism don’t work.
My conservative former friend said he would never vote for any tax for any reason.
Crazy, but true. No he didnt want anything well funded.
Conservatives are freeloaders. It’s what they don’t think social can’t work.
They know they wouldn’t contribute. They know they would exploit it.
One of the rallying cries of the Republican party that persuaded so many over the decades has always been fiscal responsibility and tax cuts. They have spent decades persuading voters that paying taxes is a terrible thing. They have claimed that bureaucracy is slow and wasteful. That the taxes people paid have been misappropriated. They have corrupted one of the most important things that a citizen can do for its nation. Pay taxes.
Paying taxes should be seen as a prideful act. This small action provides us with innumerable benefits that every single one of us benefits from.
The voting public has been lied to in an attempt to convince them they don’t receive anything from the taxes they pay. This, as most people should recognize, is a falsehood. From the roads we drive on, the water we drink, and the sewage that gets washed away to the security net that allows millions of Americans to retire every year. Taxes are the foundation that has allowed us to become the strong and comfortable nation that we are.
Taxes are the reason we have such a strong military that many Republicans idolize (while many others denounce.) Taxes are the reason we almost every child in this country has at least a cursory education. Taxes are the reason so many can pursue the careers that keep us safe and healthy, like every single doctor, nurse, and everyone else that helps and support them. Taxes are the reason your community has playgrounds for your children. Taxes are the reason so many farmers even have an income at all.
I totally agree with you. Im just sharing one ill-informed viewpoint i have seen personally.
That’s what he says… But does he drive on public roads? Does he use bridges? Does his residence have access to clean water and a functioning sewer? Etc. etc.
Absolutely he did. And he didnt want to pay for it and refused to vote for the taxes to support them.
He also bought an old truck that got 12 mpg and complained about gas prices from then on.
So your friend is constantly lobbying for dismantling the MIC, imperialism, etc.? Or they just don’t want to pay for their violent privileges?
It comes down to a fundamental lack of empathy. It’s “why should I pay for schools if I don’t have any kids” writ large.
so that illiterate gangs don’t break into your house to steal your shit or kidnap you.
They’re the kind of people that jerk off to the idea of shooting a home invader
That’s a big part of it. There’s also a lot of ignorance and stupidity.
They’ll be like “I don’t want government in health care” but also want Medicare and Medicaid.
They’re like the “no take, only throw” dog except for taxing and spending.
if you want police funded I’m afraid you’re just a conservative as well. that’s a mainstream socially conservative opinion.
I’m not against the existence of a police force, but I am against what we have now. (USA)
What do you think the difference is? You been watching too much Paw Patrol?
THe biggest difference is “qualified immunity” somehow turning into blanket immunity, followed closely by no duty to “protect and serve”. Paw Patrol takes its duty seriously, and rewards the strength of character to do the right thing and to take responsibility for their actions.
so, reformism? that’s also conservative IMO
So “Defund the Police” is a conservative movement? Huh…
Also, do you realize that “reform” and “conserve” are nearly polar opposites?
Mob justice is considered uncivilized for many reasons. There does need to be some sort of enforcement group of laws.
They should actually be educated on the law, “deescalation”, and put people over property.
police is the definition of mob justice. the police is the armed wing of the state, and solely exists to keep exploitation viable.
ironically, there would be no need for “deescalation” if the state didn’t exist because each community could just live peacefully based on mutual aid. once mutual aid gets too popular in a capitalist society, that’s when the cops show up to prevent the usurpation of state dominion over all living beings.
And as soon as we can trust everybody to respect each other, that would be a fantastic system. But, unfortunately, there are pieces of shit who will take any opportunity they can to hurt others. Removing all law enforcement will give those people a free pass, and encourage others to do the same
Makes me think of Team America. Cops are dicks, but criminals are assholes. If you don’t get the reference, look it up. It’s a fun analogy.
even if you believe that humans are inherently violent and untrustworthy (white supremacist propaganda), that would be an argument against more hierarchy and deputizing state violence not for police existing.
frankly it sounds like you don’t have lived experience with what it is that police actually do.
Your comments are especially humorous because you are WAY off.
I’ve been through the system. Long story short, I asked how to answer a question on a government form, I did what I was told, and I faced fraud charges. The cops fucked me, my defender fucked me, and the judge fucked me. I have NO faith in the system as it is.
You want to talk about being naive. Are you REALLY trying to tell me that if there was no law enforcement, that everybody would just start being nice to each other? How? Like for real, explain to me the rationale behind that.
I’m totally on your side. Fuck the police. A key lesson I taught my kids is NEVER talk to cops. Period.
Lawless anarchy won’t work either. Those power hungry people who WOULD have become cops just to bully people, are just going to do it without a badge, and we’d find ourselves in a modern wild west. Whoever has the gun, will make the rules. Even the facade of regulation we have now would be gone.
Yeah they’re called cops. They’ve enforced a racist system for centuries. They violently attack people so they can be tortured in cages.
Yes, you sound like a crappy brainwashed cartoon for adult babies.
deleted by creator
Id actually argue the majority of people are inherently good but something needs to constrain the minority of the inherently “bad”.
I’m arguing for massive reform so don’t @me about what is when we’re arguing about what should be. I’ve had enough lived experience as a melanated individual. I’ve also seen what mob justice does-while a last resort when justice is otherwise obstructed it should not be the first line when it gets things wrong so often (see lynchings).
Policing’s past as slave catchers and continued existence whereby they protect property over people is not what law enforcement should be. However, no matter what society you make there are individuals who will break laws in both minor and major ways. A lot of criminality is a result of socioeconomics but not all and there needs to be a way to enforce punishment on those exceptions in an equitable way.
sorrry, I deleted that lived experience comment because I meant to @ Ryhnoplaz not you.
so we both agree that lynchings are bad. i fail to see how police still existing helps in any way?
the same mechanisms that deputize white people to kill Black people are what leads to justifications of the police existing. the way to solve that is through abolishing hierarchies not by creating more. Black people should have an unconditional right to self-defense against racists and the police still existing is a way to prevent that. their argument is that taking justice in your own hands is harmful because white people/cops always know better than the victim.
also why do we need law enforcement in the first place? the law is inherently arbitrary and is used to criminalize people stealing food to survive and many such things. i think there needs to be a distinction between crime and harm. some crimes are harmless like distributing food and water while some harmful actions like wage theft are not de facto crimes.
lastly, I’d be curious to find out which criminalities you believe aren’t caused by socioeconomic factors? i don’t see how you could argue for that besides appealing to the human nature fallacy.